Silver to $135… or Even $300? This Big Bank Thinks So… -

Welcome to this week’s market wrap podcast, I’m Mike Gleason
Coming up don’t we’ll have another wonderful interview, this time with Phillip Newman, founding partner and managing director of <a href="https://www.metalsfocus.com/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">Metals Focus</a>. Phillip recaps the incredible rally we saw since his last guest appearance with us late last fall which saw gold and silver skyrocket and what that and the subsequent correction that took place following has meant for the precious metals market.
Phillip then discusses where things are likely headed now given the backdrop of the war with Iran and the reemergence of inflation – both in today’s economy and in the near future given the potentially disastrous ramifications of the oil shock and likely energy crisis which may ensue.
Mike Maharrey’s guest also tells us how uncertainty surrounding industrial demand for silver may impact the price of the white metal from here on out so long as the Iran war continues, and how the different scenarios of the length of the war will have a positive or negative effect on poor man’s gold specifically.
So, be sure to stick around for another wonderful Money Metals interview with this week’s guest Phillip Newman of Metals Focus, coming up after this week’s market update. And as a reminder please download, like, rate and subscribe to this podcast wherever you consume this content.
Well, it seems being a silver bug could be going mainstream.
As we reported previously at Money Metals, Bank of America released an eye-popping silver forecast, saying the price could land anywhere between $135 to $309 by the end of this year.
Even the low end of that forecast would represent a 75 percent gain from the current level!
But $135 to $309 is also an extremely wide range for that forecast… this underscores the difficulty of reading the markets in such a volatile geopolitical period.
Bank of America head of metals research Michael Widmer bases his forecast on <a href="https://www.moneymetals.com/news/2024/03/25/what-is-the-gold-silver-ratio-why-should-we-pay-attention-to-it-003075">the gold-silver ratio</a> — the number of ounces of silver it takes to buy one ounce of gold.
In the modern era, the gold-silver ratio has averaged between 40:1 and 60:1. Through the first 10 months of 2025, the gold-silver ratio was historically high, averaging 91:1. The ratio peaked in April of last year at 107:1.
By the end of the year, the ratio had plunged to 61:1 before falling to roughly 50 early this year when silver briefly broke above $110.
The ratio has crept back up in recent weeks and currently sits around 60:1, the high end of the historical norm. However, Bank of America's analyst pointed out that during significant silver bull markets, that ratio has dropped far below the average.
That’s the nature of averages. Sometimes things run far below the norm, and sometimes far above. Over the last several years, the gold-silver ratio has tended to run above the historic average. It wouldn’t be shocking for it to drop significantly below that level.
Widmer points out that in 2011, at the peak of the Great Recession precious metals bull market, the gold-silver ratio dropped to 32:1. Assuming $5,000 gold, that would push the silver price to $135.
Of course, we’ve seen gold-silver ratios even lower. During the Hunt Brothers silver squeeze in 1980, the ratio fell to 14:1. Such a ratio would yield a silver price of $309 right now.
There is even more upside if you believe the gold bull market still has legs. Many mainstream banks forecast $6,000 gold this year.
“I’ve highlighted before that the gold market has been very overbought. But it's actually still underinvested,” Widner said earlier this year. “There is still a lot of room for gold as a diversification tool in portfolios.”
Precious metals make up about 4 percent of the total financial market. However, within the professional investment sector, high-net-worth investors hold only 0.5 percent of their assets in gold. Last year, Morgan Stanley CIO Michael Wilson came out with <a href="https://www.moneymetals.com/news/2025/10/07/seismic-shift-morgan-stanley-recommends-602020-portfolio-with-20-allocated-to-gold-004389">an investment strategy that includes a 20 percent allocation to gold</a>.
Even a small uptick in investment demand could drive the gold price higher. Widner said a 55 percent increase in gold investment would drive the metal to $8,000 an ounce. And that's the <a href="https://www.moneymetals.com/news/2026/04/20/wells-fargo-debasement-trade-could-drive-gold-to-8000-004850">best-case scenario in Wells Fargo’s analysis</a>.
If gold continues to move higher, it will almost certainly take silver with it. While a large percentage of silver demand comes from industrial offtake, it is still fundamentally viewed as a monetary metal, and it tends to track with gold over time.
A move to over $300 per ounce of silver may sound extreme, but these wild price moves aren’t unprecedented. Widner pointed out that silver more than tripled in 2011 while gold gained roughly 80 percent over the same 18-month stretch. He said he thinks 2026 sets up similarly, with gold’s momentum already well established.
More fundamentally, above-ground silver stockpiles have slowly but steadily drained over the past few years. This situation precipitated <a href="https://www.moneymetals.com/news/2025/12/29/silver-squeeze-20-drives-price-over-80-004576">two silver squeezes</a> that first drove prices above $50 and then took them to that January high of over $110.
A convergence of factors from market dynamics to logistical problems led to an unprecedented silver shortage. While the market dynamics that got us here might be difficult to untangle, the situation is about as basic as it gets.
There’s not enough silver.
The silver market recorded a supply deficit for the fifth consecutive year in 2025.
Last year, demand outstripped supply by over 40 million ounces (or 1,252 tonnes). That drove the 5-year market deficit to 716 million ounces. To put that into perspective, total silver mining output last year was 846 million ounces.
Metals Focus forecasts a 46.3-million-ounce supply deficit this year.
In total, there has been a rundown of nearly half a billion ounces in the last 15 years.
When silver demand outstrips mining and recycling output, silver users must tap into aboveground stocks. That generally means rising prices to incentivize those holding silver to give it up.
That means the environment is right for additional silver squeezes.
Silver over $300 is certainly a best-case scenario, but it is clearly not out of the question. And even if the metal doesn’t reach those lofty heights this year, there is plenty of reason to remain bullish.
Lastly here, before we get to the interview let’s take a look at the weekly market action and check in on where we stand currently with a few hours left in the trading week.
Gold is down a little more than $100 or 2.3% to come in at $4,732 an ounce. Silver is down nearly $5 an ounce or 5.7% to trade at $76.87. Platinum is off 4.2% to check in at $2,028. And finally, palladium is also down 4.2% and comes in at $1,512 an ounce as of this Friday midday recording.
Well now, without further delay let’s get right to our exclusive interview with a metals market insider.
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Mike Maharrey: Greetings, I'm Mike Maharrey, and I'm pleased to be joined once again by Philip Newman. Philip is a founding partner and one of the managing directors at Metal's Focus, which is the go- to place for data and analysis relating to precious metals. So they do a lot of the legwork that gives us the supply and demand numbers that you often see. And they work with organizations such as the Silver Institute, the World Gold Council, the World Platinum Investment Council, and others to supply this very valuable data. How are you doing today, Philip?
Philip Newman: Pretty good. And it's very good to be back on your podcast. Much appreciated for having me again.
Mike Maharrey: Well, it's always a pleasure to have you. And as much as we use your data and work, we need to have you on from time to time just to kind of say thank you because we really do. What you guys do over at Metals Focus is absolutely invaluable. So we appreciate all of the hard work you and your folks do in getting all the data to us so that we can try to figure out what's going on in these crazy markets. So I'd like to just start with the Iran-US-Israel conflict because that's been probably the primary driver, at least short term of all of the markets at this point. It seems like every time Trump says something on his social media platform over there, the markets move one way or the other, so it's kind of crazy. But I'm curious just from a little bit broader perspective and from what you've seen in the metals market, are you surprised at all about the way metals have behaved throughout the conflict so far?
And has anything surprised you at all?
Philip Newman: Sure. I think first of all, we got to see that through the lens of the late January correction and just a speed with which gold and silver hit those new record highs, comfortable record highs as well in January. The speed of the rally, especially from mid-October through to late Jan, that the investment that attracted into the market with the correction. I think some investors were burnt by that. So, I think there was maybe a reticence to come back in. And I think what was also really interesting when the war broke out, I know some investors were, I think, disappointed that there was a more upside from both. Where was the safe haven action? But I think what we saw quite quickly was a very strong correlation breakout between spot gold and silver and Fed expectations in terms of where they will be setting rates or what they were talking about, especially for the balance of 2026.
So, I think what we're seeing is the war breaks out, even with the recent ceasefire, uncertainty about that. I think today's a brilliant example. April 21, in terms of expectations, would the ceasefire hold, Trump's threatening to start bumping Iran again? What does that mean for energy prices? What does that mean for inflation? And by extension, Fed expectations. Because Mike, if you go back pre-war, the markets were expecting perhaps up to two cuts before the end of this year. We then have the missiles start flying and very quickly a shift to expecting maybe a rate increase. So we will pivot in that regard. And I think where we have been recently, and I haven't checked today, if I'm honest, but we've been recently is for no rate cuts this year. And it could well be with that, as you pointed out, just as we started talking, gold is off very aggressively over a hundred bucks.
Silver is below $77. So it could well be that the markets could even be pivoting to one rate increase. We're even thinking about that for the end of this year. And of course, gold and silver don't provide a yield. And so that is weighing on both. And I think that's where we are, to be honest with you.
Mike Maharrey: Yeah, I think you're right on. And it's interesting, I did an article not too long ago looking at the performance of gold, particularly in past conflicts. And you kind of do see that there's an initial safe haven bump, and then other factors tend to drive the markets much more than the war itself. And one of the main things is the trajectory of monetary policy. So, I think you're right on target there. And it'll be interesting. I feel like the consensus was if we get through this quickly and energy prices don't spike too much, maybe we'll be all right. And of course, when we got the last CPI data, we had a huge spike in energy prices. I think gasoline was up 21%, if I remember correctly. So we definitely have seen that energy price surge. So, it'll be interesting to see how it kind of plays out.
I'm curious if, from your perspective, has the war fundamentally altered at this point your mid to longer term view of the metals markets? And if not, how long will this need to go on before we really start to see it kind of fundamentally altering the trajectory that we were kind of seeing maybe two months ago?
Philip Newman: Sure. I mean, I think those are really the $60 million questions, aren't they? When we put the forecast, the 2026 forecast together for the silver survey, that's now well over two weeks ago in terms of printing and courier times and so on. We had to come to a decision. I mean, what do we know against anyone else? We assumed a war would be short-lived and that informed our demand estimates. It informed our price expectations, and that was important because that also affected some of the price sensitive components of supply and demand for this year. But I think if the war is extended, if it goes well into late in the second quarter, into the third quarter, that could continue to weigh on prices for the reasons that we've talked about. Maybe that would actually then you're into maybe an environment of inflation expectations becoming or higher expectations of inflation becoming more entrenched.
And then from a Fed standpoint, that may force them to consider raising rates. Now, I think as we've seen, that isn't something that Trump is looking for. And so the pressure that he could put on the Fed could be really quite something to watch of great concern to the markets. We saw late last year, early this year, when there were concerns about Fed independence, that really sort of dollar come off. So in a sense, I've just described two dollar scenarios. One, war is extended, inflation remains high, looks to raise rates, not good for gold and silver. The flip side is if there's pressure and what form that pressure would take, I simply don't know. But if the markets believe there's a real risk to the Fed dependence, that could see the dollar come under pressure, which in turn could be gold and silver price positive.
But in terms of if the war, as I said, runs well into the second or into the third, that could see pressure on global growth, that could see downward expectations or revised downward expectations for some of the main areas, especially for industrial demand. So I think that's one of those risk factors out there. If you're having heightened price volatility, then that could be quite damaging for the likes of jewelry and silverware, and especially the portion which is concentrated in India, because that's the largest market for both commodities is in terms of Indian demand for jewelry and silverware. Bar demand and coin demand, a really interesting one, tends to respond well to price volatility, so we could see more upside there. So I think, Mike, I guess the key takeaway is uncertainty. That's what you're introducing there, more uncertainty in supply and demand.
Mike Maharrey: I think that's exactly the word that was running through my head as you're talking about that. And then you add to the fact that on one side, you've got the inflation worries that the Fed has to deal with. And then on the other side, you have tremendous amount of debt. You've got corporate debt, you've got government debt. And so, that is not friendly to a high-interest rate environment. So, how does the Fed walk this tightrope? And I think for me, sometimes I feel like you can kind of read the tea leaves with the central bank. I feel pretty lost right now. I'm not going to lie. It's really difficult to get a handle. And I honestly think if you asked them in an honest moment, they'd probably say the same thing, that they don't really know where it's going to go either. I think that would probably be a fair answer.
Philip Newman: Yes. And I think that even if the war is short-lived, that doesn't remove the uncertainty out of there. I mean, you've touched on it in terms of debt levels. They are a significant concern for the market. I think that's a fantastic point to make. I think also, will we see the return of tariffs? Clearly, Trump's got other things to think about right now, but that was such a feature of last year, that cliche phrase, but it's so true, this weaponization of tariffs, does that return? And I think the other really important point, unless it becomes very US-centric, but it's so relevant with your midterm elections, I think early November. Right now, there seems to be a bit of a swing in some locations to the Democrats. November's obviously a very long time away, but if that continues, what does Trump do to perhaps mobilize his base?
So, I think that could also be a concern as well. So, there's a lot out there as well. And I think the geopolitics extends into other jurisdictions. There are certainly concerns out in East Asia one has to think about as well. So there's still a lot out there, even if the war is short-lived.
Mike Maharrey: Yeah, absolutely. You still got the conflict in Ukraine with Russia and issues of NATO. I mean, there's so much out there as far as the geopolitical stuff goes.
So, here's something, and this is a little bit anecdotal on my part, but kind of watching the movement of both gold and silver, I tend to start working before the US markets open, and so you're catching the later day in Asian trading and maybe midday in European trading. And what I've noticed oftentimes is that gold will be up a little bit in that early part. And then when the US markets open, it's like, boom, it's going to go down. It tends to go down with the North American markets. And then I've also seen some of the ETF data showing that Asia is the only place that we continue to see inflows of gold into ETFs in March. So I'm curious if I have this perception that the Asian markets have remained a little bit more bullish on gold through this conflict than say North America and maybe even European markets, and there's just a little bit of a dichotomy there.
Is that something that I'm just making up or does that stand out in the data that you've seen?
Philip Newman: I think from the goal point view, yeah, absolutely. I think that's been quite interesting. And even if I think about the retail market, generally from a gold standpoint, that has been pretty strong. You've certainly seen the decent gains in lots of jurisdictions. I think it's been very widespread in terms of the coin and bar demand, for sure. So I think that's been quite fascinating. I think what's been really interesting from an institutional standpoint is the heightened volatility that you see from a price standpoint can often mean that institutional investors, if looking to invest on the CME, whether it's in the futures or the options, whatever it may be, their exposure in, say, in value terms can be less than it's been previously because the volatility is so much greater that a single trade can perhaps generate a return when compared to, I don't know, six months ago, they'd have to put on say three or four trades to get a similar return because the volatility now is so much greater.
So, I think that's been an interesting change that we've seen in the market over the past couple of months. And then you think about some of these operations, again, I'm thinking more of an institutional standpoint with the value at risk models and with that correction that we touched on earlier in late Jan that was so sizeable for both gold and silver, that has, I think, curtailed the ability of some of these institutional investors to invest to the same degree that they would've done in both markets before you had that correction. So, you've got different dynamics playing out from institutional standpoint versus a retail standpoint. And I think what was really interesting, Mike, when you look at the run up, I think especially silver in price, again, for mid-October, especially through to late Jan, I think a lot of that was more driven by retail activity, day trading really ramped up.
You see that inactivity on the Shanghai Futures Exchange, you see that in the CME main contract, for example. So that was, I think, some very interesting different dynamics that we've seen play out.
Mike Maharrey: Yeah, it's definitely been interesting. That's a good word to describe everything in the markets lately. So you mentioned the World Silver Survey that recently came out, and you guys do that in conjunction with the Silver Institute, and I've already gotten several good articles out of it, so thank you for that. But I'm curious if this was kind of the final data for 2025, and then we've got some forecasting for 2026. I'm curious, as you went through that final data, was there anything that stood out to you from last year that maybe surprised you or really stood out in terms of how silver ran through 2025?
Philip Newman: Sure. I think there's a few things, and some people may focus on the deficit being pretty modest for 2025. From our point of view, that's a little less relevant. What's more relevant is that ongoing deficit in the marketplace. I think what you see really is very little correlation between the surplus or deficit in any one year and price action. If you look at, for example, even go back as far as 2022, a record deficit over a quarter of a billion ounces, yet the silver price average less than $22, and you follow that through 2023 deficit, 200 million ounces, the price averages just over $23 an ounce. So I think that's really interesting, and that's why that was interesting for the conclusion, the fact that one of our big takeaways is that you had a pretty small deficit, but really it was that, I guess, that ongoing deficit and erosion of those stocks that helped to generate that squeeze in October.
I think one of the other things, Mike, that stands out is for industrial demand, we only had a decline of about 3% last year, and that's despite about a 6% drop in photovoltaics, despite those fireworks the end of the year, not just from a price standpoint, but what it did to lease rates as well.
Even if we put aside that incredible spike in October, yes, lease rates came down pretty quickly, but they still remained well above historical norms well into April this year, I would say. And the industries had to contend with that. So, I think that has been really quite fascinating.
Mike Maharrey: Yeah, it's interesting. One of the charts that is in the packet that you guys sent out shows that cumulative deficit over time. And it's interesting to look at that chart because you can see where you're running surpluses, not big surpluses, but you had the … And then it's like there's this big dip and it really is compelling to see how much it is accumulated over time. And as you say, any one given year, okay, but when you start piling them up one year, two, year, three, year, four years, it becomes quite substantial. And I think if my math is correct, if the projected deficit this year holds, then we're looking at over the last six years, basically an entire year of mine output, which that's a lot of silver when you start to think about in those terms.
Philip Newman: Yes, no, absolutely. Yeah. I mean, the deficit this year, as you all have seen, is slightly greater than the last year, pretty similar in the scheme of things. But obviously, as we've touched on, there's a lot of uncertainty out there, a lot of moving parts. I think it'd be really fascinating when we come in November to present even the interim and silver interim findings in New York, the flash estimates for this year, where does the deficit sit against what we were thinking for this year? I think the other point to make, those charts you highlight, I mean, I know when I presented last week, I actually said that these charts showing both the annual deficit and the cumulative deficit are two of the most important in the presentation. And I would encourage anyone listening if you've got an interest in the silver market, please do head over to the Silver Institute website.
Hopefully this presentation will be online for you to review. I think the other point, Mike, if I can make this one, is that yes, you're absolutely right where we are in terms of this deficit, but it's worth just remembering that if you compare, look at start in 2010 and go through to 2020, you had about over a 200 million ounce rise in stocks. So, that's an incredible change in position from the turn of 2020 to 25, dramatic change in the marketplace in just a few years.
Mike Maharrey: Yeah, absolutely. I'm curious, we've had much higher prices over the last several months. And so we're starting to hear talk about, especially in the solar industry of thrifting and substitution. And I'm curious from your standpoint, how realistic is the substitution thing? I mean, can they realistically substitute for a lot of the silver or is it … I've heard conflicting things. I've heard, yeah, they can switch it over pretty easily. I've heard, no, no, they have to retool and so it's not as easy. Where do we stand in terms of price going up, solar panel manufacturers looking for alternatives?
Philip Newman: Sure. I think the first thing to bear in mind is that the industry was struggling in terms of high prices in very late 2025, let alone when we were getting into what we saw the fireworks of in late January. And if you're in the industry and you've seen even for a day, over 120 bucks, it doesn't matter if prices in weekend consistently, you are going to try and thrift because you're worried that will happen again. That's why when we saw, what is it, 2011, 12 round there, silver went to 50 bucks, and after that prices really struggled for a long time, you saw thrifting. It wasn't perhaps aggressive thrifting for a while, but it was never ending. It was successive years of thrifting because they were worried that you're going to see $50 return. So it's just part of the parcel of the industry, but that was more thrifting.
What we've seen over the past few years is for, I guess there's a technology called HJT, that's what it stands for. Again, I'd encourage people to look at the silver survey. We do speak a little bit, we go into a bit more depth about some of these technologies. Now, HJT is a very small part of the market, maybe now 4% of the use of silver in photovoltaics, but when it was touted in say 2019, around there that this was coming online, it was viewed as a really exciting area because the loadings were so high. What we've seen though is that that particular HJT technology is basically moved to silver coated copper. And so even if we look as recently, if we were to benchmark say the amount of silver used in HJT in say 2021, when it first was really coming onto the market, and we compare that to now, the amount of silver is down by about 85% in that one technology, 85%.
And that again is because of the silver coated popper, and that's worked. It may be a really small part of the market, but it's commercially in play. But again, small part of the market. Most of the market now is this top-con technology that I think is about 75, maybe just a bit under that, but say in the low 70s in terms of a percentage share of the marketplace, heavy silver user. Even there, we've seen, again, if we look at, again, benchmarking 2021 with where we are, our expectations for now, that's half the amount of silver's half in that technology over that five-year period.
But what they were now looking at is can they deploy the technology that's worked so well for HJT into Topcon? Can they introduce silver coated copper? But what you've also had talk about in January is, can you replace some of the silver with copper? Now, that really would not have been a conversation last year, even at 50 or $60 silver because of the trade-off to a lower efficiency module. But silver now in the 70, $80 range, then that really is something the industry will be looking at. Now, let's be clear, it's not going to be a wholesale replacing of silver, but you could … I think the days of 2024 was when we saw a record level of silver demand in the photovoltaic market, it got up to, by basis, our estimates, about 198 million ounces of silver, but our forecast for this year is about 151.
So 26 versus 25, that's a job about 19%. And we think you're going to see further declines going forward in the use of silver in photovoltaics.
Mike Maharrey: Very interesting. Is the AI build out taking up some of that slack?
Philip Newman: Absolutely. Completely. Yeah, absolutely. You're seeing in the AI in terms of this desire, this urgency for investment in data centers, from what we understand, there's no thrifting. There is an urgency to get these data centers installed. They don't want to reduce the silver content as far as we see, so that I think is a really interesting one. You look at something like there's growth in the satellite market in the power distribution area, in the factory electric vehicles, yes, there's slow growth in the BEVs, but there's still growth. And I think at some point, especially with energy prices where they are, for some markets, that may encourage, again, more of a switch out of hybrids or ice into BEVs. And so especially when you think about the likes of when silver matters in terms of from a safety point of view, so in a car, in the braking systems or the airbags, you're not going to move away from silver.
In the defense industry where quality matters, you're not going to thrift. So there's a lot of areas. And I think that you really have, I think now to point on the head. So despite that 19% forecast from us for PV this year, we've only got a 3% drop in global silver industrial demand. So yes, it's a decline, but it's a very modest one. You've still got a market which is comfortably north of 600 million ounces for this year. So, I think that really speaks to a lot of resilience in that marketplace.
Mike Maharrey:
Yeah, absolutely. You mentioned the military application. I thought that went through my head as they've blown up an awful lot of silver in the last few weeks. I mean, I probably shouldn't laugh about something like that, but I mean, it is a reality. All of those missiles have silver in them. And don't think that once you blow them up, you can recover the silver.
Philip Newman: No, that's definitely foregone. So, you certainly got a replacement there, and that's quite interesting. And I mean, just to as a slight segue, how we look at the market is we speak to globally the main manufacturers of silver powder and pastes, silver oxide, whatever it may be, that intermediate product. And so that gives us a good idea about the global use of silver in industrial areas. It's not always easy to isolate the end use, but we certainly, I think, see more going into defense, it's just not something we can quantify.
Mike Maharrey: Yeah. I've never found anybody who is willing to quantify how much silver is used in the defense industry. That seems to be a pretty big mystery, but everybody agrees that there's quite a bit, and I think that stands to reason when you consider all of the electronic components in a modern military. Well, we've about run ourselves out of time, but before we go, I do want to have you let folks know where they can follow the work of Metals Focus, point them to the website and any other place that you may like people to go.
Philip Newman: Sure. I mean, the starting point will be metalsfocus.com. I mean, you've very kindly, Mike touched on some of the areas we do work for, the likes of the World Gold Council, obviously the Silver Institute, the context of this podcast, and the World Platinum Investment Council. We also put a lot of research out. So we have our precious metals weekly, India monthly. So, if it's interesting seeing those, do come through the website and then align to that, we do a lot of work and on services, on mine costs, doorway flows, one year, five year forecast. There's a lot out there to keep us busy, but the starting point for all of that would be our website at mellowfocus.com.
Mike Maharrey: Yeah, absolutely. And I want to reiterate the amount and the quality of work that you guys do. I mean, virtually, I would say I'd be pretty comfortable in saying every single week I'm using data that is coming from you guys in my reporting and analysis. So absolutely invaluable. And I appreciate all that you do because I know it's hard work and you've got a lot of really smart folks that are boots on the ground all over the world gathering this information. So folks, if you're following precious metals at all, you definitely need to be engaged with what is going on over at Metals Focus. And I appreciate the work you do, Philip. And I'm not just saying that because you're on my show, but it's a very sincere compliment. Well, with that, we'll wrap this up. I know you're way ahead of me in the time zone, so you're probably about ready to wrap up your day and I'm ready for lunch.
So, I'm going to let you go, but I do appreciate you being on. And again, thank you for the work that you do and we'll definitely have you back on here in the near future as things continue to unfold.
Philip Newman: Well, thank you. Appreciate it and look forward to next time.
Mike Maharrey: All right. Thank you.
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Always great analysis from our friends there at Metals Focus and I hope you enjoyed that interview.
Well, that will do it for this week. Be sure to check back next Friday for our next Weekly Market Wrap Podcast. And remember to tune in as well to the Money Metals Midweek Memo, hosted by Mike Maharrey.
To check out any of our audio programs just visit <a href="https://www.moneymetals.com/podcasts">MoneyMetals.com/podcasts</a> or find them on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts. And as a big help to us we would ask you to please like, subscribe, download and rate our podcasts. Doing so helps us extend the reach of this material.
Until next time, this has been Mike Gleason with <a href="https://www.moneymetals.com">Money Metals Exchange</a>, thanks for listening and have a wonderful weekend everybody.

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